[Magic Wheel Memory]

Originally Posted by SuchFriendsAreDangerous

We need to remember and mourn these tragic shootings at mid-western white neighborhood schools. However, something as tragic, is that every week in the United States a teenager is shot and killed nearby or even at their school campus. Going to school in many neighborhoods in America, is literally a life and death matter. Not necessarily for privileged white kids, and that is why largely white tragedies like these take the spotlight, but why are the rest of dead and killed American teenagers not noticed? Where is their memorial? What always makes me upset in America is that very few Americans think of ALL Americans as being the same as them, as being equally American. We here in America are ALL Americans, and American tragedies should affect us all, not just when it happens in white neighborhoods. Let us mourn this tragedy today, but let us not neglect to mourn ALL the kids who are wrongfully killed by gun violence. Let us support those kids whose daily reality is one of menacing fear and foreboding dread.

Yes, you're right that all childrens' tragedies must be recognized and prevented. But what happened in Newtown would have been a big story had it happened in any American neighborhood to people of any color. What makes it especially shocking is that an adult, after killing his mother, travelled to the school specifically to murder these young children. That doesn't happen very often, and I find it hard to believe that it was such a big story because the children were white.

Certainly there are neighborhoods, many of them minority neighborhoods, where violence is part of daily life. And it's disgusting that more is not done about it. But I do believe that America is aware of it. There is a quite a bit of media coverage and pop culture references to minority gangs and crime in inner cities. "Bloods" and "Crips" are household words. I don't think the tragedy is that nobody notices, but the fact that not enough is done about it.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by Magic Wheel Memory

YI don't think the tragedy is that nobody notices, but the fact that not enough is done about it.

In that regard, whether to mass shootings, school killings, or urban violence, indeed many folks take notice but not enough is done about it.

[tesla69]

Most everything in this article is documented in one form another up to The Motive, whcih I don't exactly buy.

http://rense.com/general95/mkultra.html

But this is weird:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibRw4...layer_embedded

And I've been wondering why we have been seeing one old grainy photo over and over. he started taking college classes at age 16. Sure he smashed his harddrive, but why can't the feebs and nsa recreate his activity looking at the isp records? And aren't there any security video from the school showing a single person busting in, and not the 3 killers some are speaking about.

[Keeping It Simple]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

My cousins kid who is a freshman in high school......killed her first hog yesterday evening just after getting out of school. That is one big azz hog!

 

Yeah, I'm sure she feels good about herself shooting dead an innocent, innocuous animal from a great distance with a sniper rifle. Hunting animals for sport has always been an abhorrence and it always will.

[dale_gribble]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

That is a 300+ lbs Wild Boar that can kill a man.

The amount of devastation a pack of these can cause to Texas landowners is staggering......so much so they are free game at any time. In the State of Texas, you don't need a permit or hunting license to kill these. My only regret is she didn't kill one where our Federal Government pays out bounties on such a kill!

If you haven't heard, our Governor, Rick Perry is all for backing teachers who have their conceal carry license to pack a gun in class if they choose to do so......some school districts are willing to pay extra to teachers who do so : )

everything about this post is awesome! are they going to eat that boar? i imagine it would be pretty tasty. also did she drink the blood after killing it?

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

I noticed that she wasn't using a military style assault rifle with an extended magazine masquerading as a hunting rifle with silly names like Bushmaster. Neither was she carrying an over-powered yet easily concealable hand gun which essentially is designed to do one thing very effectively, hurt or kill other people. See, I can dig the hunting thing, and hunting riffles and shotguns I got no beef with. Its machine guns and dangerous pistols that concern me. I read a Republican OP-ED which mentioned that murder rates and gun violence are at historic lows, and yet these same Republicans refuse to concede that gun-control is the cause of this reduction. In all the major cities and states which had the highest murder rates, California-LA, New York-NYC, District of Colombia and DC, Illinois and Chicago, we've seen strict regulation imposed at a state and county level on guns, handguns, and especially ammunition. The result? Significant declines in homicide. In 1992 there over 3000 (!!!!!) murders in Los Angeles County. In 2012 there will have been less than 550.. What are gun owners so afraid of? Since when it is a constitutional right to own military weapons or extended magazines or several pistols? It is nobodies right, and as an American I will stand up to any motherfucker about this issue, period.

Tell the NRA to eat a fat dick yo!

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

On a more serious note, I read earlier today that there had been 100 United States gun deaths SINCE Sandy Hook (over the past eight days) while Britain, France, Germany Japan, Sweden & Denmark combined for only 112 in all of 2011.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Bytor Peltor again.

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

I doubt my niece had a handgun on her person, but I know for a fact she knows how to use one: load, unload, point and shoot and hit what you're aiming at. I also have no doubt that her uncle next to her in the picture or her dad (the one taking the picture) were strapped as they never venture into the wilds without.

Personally, I have no desire to own assault weapons (riffle / machine gun style). I also believe 30 round clips are pointless, other than the helicopter video I posted earlier. I believe the Federal Government will somehow try to regulate these particular items. Make no doubt about it, the Federal Government will have a massive fight on it's hands and I doubt they will win, but it wouldn't her my feelings if they did.

This being said, we're talking about the Federal Government where they never do anything black and white. Any restrictions they come up with will somehow be beyond the scope of assault weapons and this is will what will fuel the battle of gun owners rights.

Why the massive fight? Who in their right mind honestly could contest a ban on ultra-dangerous weapons? They are called assault weapons because they were designed for forward military operations, an assault. Further, why do Americans need to own SEVERAL hand guns? Why not ask for an ID when buying ammunition? If it is for honest purposes, why not be honest about it? See these are the kinds of regulations that have worked in California and Los Angeles County for years now. We have state and local level assault weapons bans, hand gun purchase limits, and mandatory ID for ALL ammunition. The net result? Lawful gun owners have their shit, and we have less crime and murders as the criminals lose access.

Of course, Byron, you already should know that I am TOTALLY opposed to ALL gun ownership and sales in this country. The grim reality Americans need to face is that bad guys and good guys get their guns from the same places, so if you cut off the guns, you cut off the bad guys. This is what has worked in California and D.C. and N.Y.C and we believe it can work in the entire nation as well. As it is, if the Federal Government can't get its shit together, the local states, counties and cities can easily pursue as have California and New York.

Guns don't kill people, people kill people, but if you take away the guns, you eliminate more than half the chance. Other societies seem to be able to handle the responsibility of guns just fine, in Finland 1 in 3 people own a gun and their murder rates and gun violence rates are quite literally an embarrassment to American culture and society. So really, guns aren't the problem, but clearly armed Americans is

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

Thank you for your last post as it totally makes the point for me. Persons such as yourself will say one thing when the reality is they truly desire something else and this is why there will be a massive fight......not to mention the billions of dollars generated from the manufacturing of weapons.

This is probably the best place and time to mention this......since local states started submitting licenses for conceal carry, NOT ONE conceal carry individual has been involved in a mass shooting. Neither have they wrongfully shot / responded in an inappropriate way with their conceal carry weapons.

Slow your roll. Society is about reality and reality is about compromise. Only the people can succeed in eliminating or prohibiting anything in their communities. It is not a top down, it is a bottom up situation. So legislation alone is empty to remove gun violence from our communities. At this stage in the game, a reasonable and adult compromise is to remove assault weapons, restrict hand guns, and regulate ammunition by ID-only purchasing requirements (as is the current scenario in California)

By removing all guns, I would not suggest strictly legislation rather a paradigm shift in the community. In LA we used to have gun shops all over the place, now just a few retailers. We also used to have 3000 murders, and now we have a six-fold decrease. Again, how can you as a gun owner defend owning military style weapons, or extended magazines, or multiple pistols, or completely unrestricted ammunition? Is it that hard for you to pull out your ID to by some more rounds if it will keep the criminals who you own your gun to protect yourself against from having ammunition in the first place?

[the ikara cult]

Nikitchyuk criticized the proposal. "Do you really want to have a shootout like in O.K. Corral in our schools?" he told CBS News. "Where will you find the money in the budget for the additional policemen? Where will you find money in the budget for bullet-proof windows and doors? Do we want a prison system in place of our schools? They will be locked in, right, just like that, and everyone will be afraid of everyone. Why are we doing that?

[jon boy]

the last person i want to own any kind of gun, let alone an assault rifle is an american. i mean its not as if anything bad happens when americans with guns are around.

[jon boy]

 

[Genteel Death]

Does Jonboy feel bad about the dead children killed by a gun?

[the ikara cult]

It says alot how every time these things happen the gunman is either killed by the police or his own hand, almost never by the fantasy Lone Ranger bystander with a handgun.

[the ikara cult]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

EXACTLY - when that teacher hid all her students in cubby holes and closets, she could have had a little something EXTRA for that nut when he entered her classroom instead of just saying, "they're in the gym." She could have shot and killed him first, saving her life and the lives of the children in the next classroom.

Personally, I feel that any teacher who can react fast enough to hide her students is sensible enough to remove a hand gun for a safe and use it in the right way when the gunman enters her classroom.

OR she gets shot first, he comes into the classroom, finds all the kids and theres 20 more dead children. Id say theres a 50/50 chance of that, and id err on the side of hiding the kids rather than taking out the gun. Do you want all your schoolteachers militarised? a loaded handgun in their desk?

In that situation the gun would have to be within quick, easy access to the teacher for the fantasy OK Corall scenario. And therefore in quick, easy access to the students as well, every single day. The killer got his guns where he knew he could find them; his mothers own stash. You think kids wouldnt be able to get into teachers cabinet if they really wanted to?

[jon boy]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

EXACTLY - when that teacher hid all her students in cubby holes and closets, she could have had a little something EXTRA for that nut when he entered her classroom instead of just saying, "they're in the gym." She could have shot and killed him first, saving her life and the lives of the children in the next classroom.

Personally, I feel that any teacher who can react fast enough to hide her students is sensible enough to remove a hand gun for a safe and use it in the right way when the gunman enters her classroom.

or the teacher is the person that has a psychotic episode and decides to kill a bunch of kids and has access to a handgun.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by jon boy

 

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to jon boy again.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

 

The ONLY place for the OK Corral at elementary schools in America

 

[the ikara cult]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

So many offered up: "WHAT IF's."

The State / Federal Government has criteria / background checks one must pass before issuing a conceal carry license. Ideally, someone who is mentally unstable would be weeded out. SURE - a teacher who is stable now may become unstable 5 years from now, so teachers who want to conceal carry on campus may need to be held to a higher level of scrutiny of yearly checks.

I do think it's important we all realize that any teacher at any time could bring a gun to school and shoot up the place. Just think of the thousands and thousands of teachers who have handguns at home, any morning they could place that gun on their person and enter the school. Best I can remember is no teacher has ever shot up her class room, but it has ALWAYS BEEN a possibility.

In the scenario I provided in the previous post, the teacher who reacted in time to hide her students would then have time to retrieve her gun......best case scenario being the students never see her holding the gun. Excuse me, but ONLY A FOOL would think said teacher would keep a weapon just lying in a desk or cabinet drawer - ABSOLUTELY NOT!

There would be requirements to keep it in a fingerprint safe that was mounted to the floor or wall.

 

These type safes are so well built you could spend the entire day with crowbar trying to gain entry and you would end up with tired hands and a wasted day. One manufacture use to offer a one-hundred thousand dollar reward for anyone who could gain entry using nothing but a crowbar or sledgehammer.

you actually introduced the "what ifs" with your fantasy land where every teacher has a weapon so dont you get all high and mighty about that.

Anyway, a teachers sanity should not be weighed up after we've put a handgun in his hand. In the UK we have had ONE definite case of a police officer wrongly killing a civilian with a gun in my whole life. You can trust the police with guns if they know that other people arent likely to have them.

As for what you say about the teacher who hid her students. She didnt have a fucking gun, she hid the kids away and saved their lives. What if the teacher ISNT a quick thinking, dynamic person in that scenario? You wanna train your teachers as if theyre prison guards? Theres a nice old saying Americans have that says "Give me liberty or give me death". Maybe the best way of preventing the last of those is stopping people having stashes of deadly firearms in their houses. Just a thought.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by Bytor Peltor

So many offered up: "WHAT IF's."

The State / Federal Government has criteria / background checks..

Upwards of 40% (!!!) of the firearms sold in America annually. This is a loophole that needs to be closed but too many "guns' rights" folks resist even this simple task. So we have a myth that guns are strictly controlled through background checks when the reality is their not. Further, US arms retailers report 30,000 missing or stolen firearms to the ATF each year, that just what they bother to report. As to carrying permits, I think no body realistically wants schoolteachers to be armed, the reasonable compromise is to put armed police in every single one of 99,000 public schools in America. While it is plausible, it seems honestly ridiculous. Further, big surprise the NRA would promote a plan that essentially says, "Hey, go out and buy 100,000 guns for the schools."

I do think it's important we all realize that any teacher at any time could bring a gun to school and shoot up the place. Just think of the thousands and thousands of teachers who have handguns at home, any morning they could place that gun on their person and enter the school. Best I can remember is no teacher has ever shot up her class room, but it has ALWAYS BEEN a possibility.

In the scenario I provided in the previous post, the teacher who reacted in time to hide her students would then have time to retrieve her gun......best case scenario being the students never see her holding the gun.

So would you really trust your kids' schoolteachers in a shootout not to hit your own children in the crossfire? That is the Pandora's Box about this issue, it would be all the worse a tragedy if school teachers or just armed citizens accidentally harm or kill innocent people in the crossfire. And no, I don' condone or forgive people for such accidents in the name of trying to help. Helping is automatically negated when such assistance results in grievous bodily harm or worse, death and loss of life.

I've already proposed the simplest solution, the one which is in effect in LA County. Mandatory nationwide ID-checks for the purchase of ANY ammunition ANYWHERE in the country under ANY circumstance. If folks are buying such ammunition for honest purposes, they have nothing hide or worry about.

[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Originally Posted by the ikara cult

Anyway, a teachers sanity should not be weighed up after we've put a handgun in his hand. In the UK we have had ONE definite case of a police officer wrongly killing a civilian with a gun in my whole life. You can trust the police with guns if they know that other people arent likely to have them.

This statement makes me more depressed than even the Newton shootings,because here in the Los Angeles area alone, we have about 100 officer involved shootings which result in death, and upwards of 30% of those figures are unarmed folks wrongly killed in the process of apprehension. In LA they have a shoot first explain later philosophy, and they don't shoot people in the leg, we're talking strictly kill shots