[SuchFriendsAreDangerous]

Black Keys. These dudes used to suck. These dudes used to suck bad. I've ditched their set as the opening band twice because I didn't like them. Well, once I didn't go in, the other time I tried to stand through it but I just was like meh.. so I went outside and toked it in the parking lot and came back in later. Then after Attack and Release, these guys are bad! This shit kicks ass! And too think, they used to open for bands at the Henry Fonda and now they are about the be headlining at the Staples Center as if they were the Lakers!

Radiohead. I just don't dig their first few albums but I after OK Computer I really like it. There are a lot of haters, but popularity does that.

Now for the suck column..

The Casualties: These guys were a kick ass crust band. Then their mohawks became a fashion and their music a cliche. At least the Subhumans and the Varukers aged gracefully and are still interesting and relevant.

System of a Down: Their self-titled debut is still one of the greatest albums I have ever heard. It was such a unique combination of so many elements of sound, and it was heavy as shit. Then every thing after has just sort of sucked..

your turn..

[Screaming Skull]

Band of Horses. Their debut is an indie-rock classic and everything they've done since blows chunks.

[truncated]

Jimi Tenor started out well, then got more experimental than his talent allowed for.

[EVOLghost]

Yeah soad's first album is amazing. I still dig their other stuff though. Fun fucking music.

[Mortte Jousimo]

There are not many artists I listen whose material from the beginning to middle I don´t like at all, but here´s few kind of:

Sielun Veljet - I really don´t understand that band at first at all (the reason is I was ten years old when they came so I wasn´t at the right age). Then they made their acoustic album Suomi-Finland in 1988 and I realised how great they were! And I started also love their earlier material (their first album from 1983 is really great, a true Finnish accompanion to Birthday Party´s Prayers in Fire, only SV debut has something real deep Finnish, something very shamanistic).

Regina - I really didn´t like their only-machine-made pop at all. Then in their third album they started to add natural instruments and I think also the music changed little bit deeper. I don´t still like their earlier material.

the Beatles - Well, this is sort of. There was period, when I think their before Rubber Soul -material isn´t as serious as the after-material. Now I love them all.

John Parish - I think he was quite mediocre with his band Automatic Dlamini, but when he started his solo career, he has been brilliant!

And then the now sucks...(there are quite many of them, here´s few)

Stooges - their sixties/seventies material is just great. Weirdness don´t sound Stooges at all. Why they didn´t make it under some other name or Iggy´s solo?

Red Hot Chili Peppers - Sad example, how band full of energy turned into very boring middle-aged ballad band. I´m glad there are some great artists to whom that didn´t happend at least so badly, of course no-one can´t be forever angry young band. For example Sonic Youth, Nick Cave, Dr. John and the Who have made great albums also in the old age. Tom Waits is a funny exception; he was much more serene in the seventies than now!

Rush - I don´t say they totally suck now, but I have had no reason to listen their albums after Presto.

Genesis - They were very great in the seventies (with Peter Gabriel) then they turned slowly towards AOR. Well, I like a little bit their "We Can´t Dance"-album, but after Phil Collins material has been just boring.

Jimi Tenor - This is already mentioned. I really love his band Jimi Tenor and his Shamans, but somehow I haven´t like his solos very much. And the last albums I´ve heard (that are based on the African tradion) just don´t hit me because I think Jimi just can´t achieve them the right mood and feelings. Maybe because he´s not African born (of course there are exceptions, for example sixties band Love sound real English altough they´re Americans).

[Mortte Jousimo]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

And set aside your misplaced sense of "loyalty" will you, Sonic Youth turned to shit.

I don´t have any need to be loyal to any artists. It just so that I love almost every material Sy has made. If they will make album that is full of songs like Thunderclap for Bobby Pyn, I´m not gonna love it.

[EVOLghost]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

And set aside your misplaced sense of "loyalty" will you, Sonic Youth turned to shit.

ouch...



sonic is and forever will be great.

[EVOLghost]

That wasn't loyalty either that was fanboy_ism

[EVOLghost]

Originally Posted by Murmer99

yeah I was admittedly being a dick, but I really wasn't too impressed by a lot of their albums from the 90s or 2000s.. hit or miss for me. It just wasn't nearly as exciting. Maybe I haven't been in the right mood to appreciate A Thousand Leaves... I've seen the record get a lot of praise on here and I wish I could understand why.

Diamond Sea, Rain on Tin, Hits of Sunshine, most of NYC Ghosts & Flowers, and all of sonic nurse are the highlights from their second half in my opinion. I even think that Experimental Jet Set, Trash and No Star is a fun record to listen to. So it evidently isn't entirely without merit.

Ye. I understand. But SY just hit at the perfect time I guess.....


I have nothing but unconditional love for SY.

[ann ashtray]

The Casualties always sucked. Nothing "crusty" about them. Just stupid fucks sporting mohawks ramblin' on about booze and "oi" in virtually every song. They aren't punk, they are tools. They've taken every iconic punk rock cliche...from lyrics to look, and have repetitively made themselves look like the morons that they are.

I wouldn't say System of Down ever "sucked", but they were always boring as all fuck. Oooh, let's add some weird middle eastern vibe to what the Dead Kennedy's were doing 20 years ago. BORING!

As far as Black Keys, I honestly think they used to be wayyyy better than what they are now. They're still OK, just feel much more safe.

[Starcat]

Good call Murmer on Gang of Four, Misfits, and kind of on Sonic Youth... Not that they've ever released a BAD album, they just had a period of hit or miss, dull or exciting, between Washing Machine and The Eternal that ended a streak of always incredible albums before that. The Eternal, being as great as it is, keeps them from being on any list of decliners.

USED TO SUCK:
Big Black
My Bloody Valentine

SUCK NOW:
The Raveonettes
The Yeah Yeah Yeahs
Jesus and Mary Chain (there's already a thread about this, but yeah)
The Cure

[Mortte Jousimo]

I think I have said this million times, but I say it once again. This "Sonic Youth has turned to shit" is really hard to me understand, because I think there hasn´t been very big changes in their music since EVOL. I think their every album is a little bit different, but all of them has that regognizable SY-sound. OK, they have become more mature, but I think it´s quite natural, I think they will sound very ridiculous if they try to sound today like they sound in 1985. Also these "SY turned to shit" are ridiculous in my opinion, because somebody thinks they turned to shit after BMR, somebody thinks after EJSANS and somebody thinks after Nurse. So there is no sense.

And I think they have had mediocre songs in their albums already in the beginning, I think "Making Nature Scene", "Ghost Bitch" and "Justice is Might" are very mediocre songs, but fit well in the album entities like "Thunderclap" and "What we Know" fit into Eternal. I´m sorry if I said badly about something that is holy to somebody.

[Starcat]

oh come on... you can't say that the songs on rather ripped would've made sense on EVOL. They've had at least two major stylistic periods since then. The shift between them was slow, which is why people have identified different albums beyond which things got boring: But the fact remains that SY went through a time in the 90s where their albums started getting boring.

And asskiss, listen to the original songs on "Lungs" and you'll see what I mean... A lot of it had to do with bad recording conditions and inappropriate equipment, but it's still totally awful. Even Steve Albini has said so

[demonrail666]

Guns n Roses decline has been pretty steep (regardless of where you ranked them in the beginning).

[Pookie]

Surely the list of bands that were great but became shit is almost never ending? Isn't that just what bands do?

[Starcat]

Some of the songs on Lungs are REALLY great live at Big Black's peak, so the greatness is definetly there... Maybe expecting to hear Big Black epicness and getting the pitiful whine of Lungs makes the leap seems additionally insurmountable. In any case, those recordings make me cringe.

And pookie's totally right... the list of bands that went from good to bad is the same as the ones on the list of bands who fall into the category of "I liked their first album, but their later stuff is meh.", and that's applicable to MOST bands with multiple albums, because they stuff the first LP with the tried-and-true singles that made them well-known enough to get a record deal. Having to work for deadlines and meet the demands of record companies is enough to stunt the creativity of even the best bands after they're been squeezed for enough albums. Unless you're The Fall or Ty Segall and can pump out three albums a year just from scraping together the singles that accumulate every week. Or you're Sonic Youth and can tweak your style or rely on a formula with enough dexterity to keep albums good for decades.

[Mortte Jousimo]

Originally Posted by Starcat

oh come on... you can't say that the songs on rather ripped would've made sense on EVOL. They've had at least two major stylistic periods since then. The shift between them was slow, which is why people have identified different albums beyond which things got boring: But the fact remains that SY went through a time in the 90s where their albums started getting boring.

And asskiss, listen to the original songs on "Lungs" and you'll see what I mean... A lot of it had to do with bad recording conditions and inappropriate equipment, but it's still totally awful. Even Steve Albini has said so

Fact! Can anybody say there are some facts in music? I think they´re opinions.

Maybe I´m deaf, but I can´t hear lot of difference between Reena and Starpower. Both are very beatiful, melodic pieces, well maybe there is a little bit more creepy guitar in the middle of Starpower.

Can you describe me what those stylistic changes are? I think SY started with making some sense in the middle of chaos and noise (1st album, CIS, BMR) then added melodies (that I love the most) then (EVOL, Sister). In DDN they added elements of conventional rock and in Washing Machine they went back to more experimental style. The high point of experimentalism was NYC ghosts and I am glad they again took melodic elements back in Murray Street. So there has been changes, but I won´t call them stylistic changes.

Anyway the point of my writings is not that everybody should like every Sonic album, although it´s hard to understand why someone not like Eternal if he liked for example Goo. The point is that I think too many music fans (also too many music reviewers) are like children who get angry when their favourite artists refuse to full their needs anymore. Many have said here, they have right to expect great albums from SY. They´re wrong, SY can make album full of country-covers or even dull Chris Rea-style ballads if they like and it´s none of fucking business.

[Mortte Jousimo]

Originally Posted by Pookie

Surely the list of bands that were great but became shit is almost never ending? Isn't that just what bands do?

I think this is very common opinion and also true in the most cases, but there are artists who seem to continue making good music also in the old age. I think there are too many music fans, who just don´t listen some artist only for that reason he has been in the musicbisness over ten or more years.

[demonrail666]

Originally Posted by Mortte Jousimo

Reena and Starpower. Both are very beatiful, melodic pieces, well maybe there is a little bit more creepy guitar in the middle of Starpower.

Can you describe me what those stylistic changes are?

I don't have the knowledge or vocabulary to describe stylistic differences but, to my ears anyway, Reena sounds like a band that's become a bit bored with itself while Starpower doesn't - and has creepy guitars.

[EVOLghost]

Originally Posted by Starcat

The Raveonettes

Truth.....Lust Lust Lust was the last album I got from them. It was ok. I mean it started off great...but I dunno....just got boring the more I listened to it.