[batreleaser]

Originally Posted by sarramkrop

Listen to all the noise bands first, then make up your mind.

\

shut the fuck up

[fugazifan]

Originally Posted by batreleaser

And whoever said John Cage is the nest in modern noise, I highly disagree. I can't stand his music, the guy has some balls to record and perform silence for nine minutes and think some hack academic types are gonna hail its brilliance. I respect the man for his ideas and theory, but as far as his music, no thanks. He's the ultimate in overly academic snobbery music. If we're talking 20th cent Avant Composition, I'd take Xenakis, Partch, Stockhausen, Boulez, and Varese everyday. But then again, I've only recently been getting into this stuff (past year) and have limited knowledge on the subject. I'm a rock n roll mothafucka.

it was 4:33
four minutes 33 seconds long. notaded silence.
people seem to forget that cage had many other works besides 433.

Merzbow is the only one who will survive from a strictly noise point of view. Argue your stupid points all you like about it.

Originally Posted by batreleaser

I love Wolf Eyes, but again, I don't see it. I just said the Skaters because that music seriously shoots you into outer space, takes you out of your body, and that's what good noise should do.

I read a review of the Skaters in Blastitude that said they were the honest heirs to Sun Ra because they're creating music to blast us into the outer galazxy to escape the horrors of the Earth, and they're better at it than Sun Ra because they didn't decide to go into a "Big Band" phase to gloss over thier music to bring lame people along for the ride. Hell no, if you are going to listen to the Skaters, you can't be thinking it's going to be a serene experience, but no, as with other things that connect you to the cosmos (like acid) it can sometime be a very difficuilt experience, but ultimately highly rewarding.

Stop pretending that you love music and start enjoying it. You secretly hate most of it, therefore make it sound boring when you have to write about it. You should be made to hate all of it for one day and then understand ''things''. Also, you have no durable place in the world of writing, 'cause you're writing is shit, etilist, pointless, and ultimately yawnsome for anyone who would like to get into any of the artists I'm sure you don't even listen to properly yourself.

Originally Posted by Glice

Total win.

In other news - noise music is an area of music that focuses less on melody/ harmony/ rhythm and more on timbre and volume dynamics. It doesn't really focus on dissonance - you'd need to ask Wagner and Xenakis about that (and Radelescu if you're in the mood to be bored silly). It's not really radical, and hasn't been since about 1942 or so. It's a sometimes interesting genre.

I disagree with this. Noise music is repellent and extreme to a lot of people, what some musicians (few I imagine) who try to put themselves above it all think is another thing altogether. Judging it by the sort of crowds that go to these sort of gigs or listen to a lot of it is one thing, playing it in front of 'normal' people is another thing altogether.

[Dead-Air]

Originally Posted by batreleaser

And whoever said John Cage is the nest in modern noise, I highly disagree. I can't stand his music, the guy has some balls to record and perform silence for nine minutes and think some hack academic types are gonna hail its brilliance. I respect the man for his ideas and theory, but as far as his music, no thanks. He's the ultimate in overly academic snobbery music. If we're talking 20th cent Avant Composition, I'd take Xenakis, Partch, Stockhausen, Boulez, and Varese everyday. But then again, I've only recently been getting into this stuff (past year) and have limited knowledge on the subject. I'm a rock n roll mothafucka.

Since I think you have good taste in music overall, I urge you to actually listen to a broader sampling of Cage's work than you obviously have. Cage was in no way an academic snob, as his willingness to associate with the Fluxists clearly indicates. There are definitely some academic snobs out there who have appropriated the man onto a pedestal that he never asked for and had no use for, but so what? That has no reflection on his music.

Check out "First Construction in Metal", "Imaginary Landscape No. 1", "Radio Music", and "Rozart Mix" then tell me this guy wasn't decades ahead of his time and setting the standard that much of the crazy shit we listen to stems from.

"4'33"" is one of the most misunderstood pieces ever, because it's not actually about the silence, it's about the sound of a room full of people in anticipation of sound and the sounds the musician makes turning the blank pages in the sheet music. That said, it's far from his greatest work and he has some stuff that is absolute mindfuckingly good listening.

To answer your original question, Merzbow is clearly the Jim Hendrix of noise music and revered on that same level of worship.

I don't really have a favorite noise musican myself. I mean, Crank Sturgeon, but I think of him more as a genius performance artist than noise musician, despite the fact that the noise scene fully embraces him.

[Decayed Rhapsody]

Silver Session. The end.

[atsonicpark]

I'd also like to say that Cage has a lot of interesting works; I particularly enjoy "Works for Percussion"... and he does have some works that are pretty damn noisey... I'm not a huge fan, but I definitely like Cage's music. As far as his personality, he seems like a dickhead.

[Trasher02]

Originally Posted by blunderbuss

Are there any modern noise artists have recorded a totally silent piece ? They'd get my vote for best ever.

Yup, John cage's 4:33

[atsonicpark]

Someone already replied that.

And John Cage isn't a "modern noise artist".

[gohleekwang]

Just a question: on band sound only (not john cage or merzbow), any band actually as noisy+creative as SY?

[fugazifan]

Originally Posted by gohleekwang

Just a question: on band sound only (not john cage or merzbow), any band actually as noisy+creative as SY?

yes

[atsonicpark]

thinking fellers union local # 282 is about 100x more creative than sonic youth, for starters.

[gohleekwang]

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

thinking fellers union local # 282 is about 100x more creative than sonic youth, for starters.

"fellers union local # 282" is this the band name?

[blunderbuss]

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

And John Cage isn't a "modern noise artist".

Thank you.

[afterthefact]

Originally Posted by fugazifan

it was 4:33
four minutes 33 seconds long. notaded silence.
people seem to forget that cage had many other works besides 433.

People here also seem to forget that I already brought this up ON PAGE ONE!

Not that I care...

I like Cage, an I mentioned him because of the question about a silent piece. That being said, I don't consider him noise. He's got stuff that may sound noisy, but it's not NOISE, as a genre of music.

[gualbert]

Originally Posted by Trasher02

Yup, John cage's 4:33

I have the feeling that some musicians are close to burst in laughter ( preventing it is the hardest part of the job ).
This also is funny: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSulycqZH-U

[Dead-Air]

Originally Posted by atsonicpark

As far as his personality, he seems like a dickhead.

How so?

He was a really brilliant guy with an almost oracular vision of where music would go (he's the first composer to state outright that all music would be electric by the end of the 20th century). Plus he was very supportive of other artists and from all I've read a kind and gentle soul. Aside from taking his own music seriously, which is something that I don't think reflects poorly on an artist at all, he was incredibly unpretentious. Not that there isn't humor in a lot of his music either, just subtle humor.

It is true that he has been very propped up by some uptight academics (I once caused quite a fracas on the John Cage mailing list by suggesting that you could easily play 4'33" with a whoopie cushion rather than a piano), but that is no more of a reason to judge him harshly than it would be to judge Nirvana harshly because a lot of mainstream pop music idiots like their most famous hit songs.

I swear a lot of people just want to reject Cage off hand because he is so well known, and that the bias that being intelligent and sincere at the same time isn't cool is prevalent.

I would agree he's not a "noise musician" because he has much more breadth to his music than just noise, some of it being rather straight forward piano pieces. However, he is a very important figure in the development of noise as a part of the palette in modern music.

To see how he fits into the broad scope of noisy music, I highly recommend the Sub Rosa compilation An Anthology of Noise & Electronic Music Vol. 1 which has his "Rozart mix" alongside the likes of Sonic Youth, Einsturzende Neubauten, Gordon Mumma, and Survival Research Laboratories. That whole series of comps. is incredible and puts the best 20th Century composers right next to everyone from Throbbing Gristle to Merzbow, doing an incredible job of breaking down the context that makes people judge a given artist as "academic" vs. "street music".

[afterthefact]

Dead-Air, is there anything you don't know or can't do?

Your profound knowledge of seemingly every interesting subject, or possible every subject for that matter, never ceases to amaze me.

Can anyone with a degree of good knowledge make an extentive list of any odiern noise band etc worth listening to from a point of view that isn't just their own personal taste? You know, with a little explanation as to why one should check the music out and why it stands out from the rest. I'm thinking of people like DJ Rick or people who probably post rarely on here. I'd appreciate that, since all this talk about John Cage is interesting but not related to anything particularly relevant to the threads's title.