[Bytor Peltor]

Because I haven’t done anything to support Trump!

Go back to the beginning of this thread and you won’t find any post -by me- supporting Trump. It wasn’t until March or April of this year that I started posting in this thread......because of the hypocrisy and lies......because the things being said -like in the video- simply WERE NOT TRUE!

Or better yet -like the video- just because you say it DOESN’T MAKE IT TRUE!

Not once have I tried to make things personal and I haven’t cursed or attacked anyone. There is nothing hateful about wanting a secured border, they need to start building the wall today! Matter of fact, Democrats Voted To Do That In 2006. Obama and Clinton gave lip service to the need of a secured border/building a wall......but they just dangled the carrot.

Sure, there are things I don’t like about Trump, but the same is probably true about a great deal of our politicians......they just don’t have the media banging the drum against them 24 hours a day.

Originally Posted by h8kurdt

And I'll never understand how you can say that with a straight face whilst still supporting Trump. The guy whose whole political movement is based on hatred and dividing people. The hypocrisy is astounding.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Skuj

It's clear to me that on Friday there was very strong hints of evidence that actually points to Trump. This was a big turning point in the revelations from Mueller.

Am I wrong?

there is always a turning point but trump is not going to be removed from office

remember how in the blasey testimony repuke senators would say shit like “i believe her! i believe that something happened to her... but i think it was with a different person”

lmao

look, kellyanne is gonna write everyone’s script and even if impeachment happens there will be no removal from office in the senate. big if.

sure tactics are tactics and obstructing evil is good but this can’t be all that democrats have to offer the nation

[Skuj]

I agree with you to a certain extent, and these revelations do mostly center on him directing hush money payments, which most people won't care very much about.

We'll hear much more about Russia/collusion in due course.....and maybe nobody will give a fuck then either, because who really cared about that disaster known as the Helsinki Summit?

If he can get away with Helsinki, he can get away with anything.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Skuj

I agree with you to a certain extent, and these revelations do mostly center on him directing hush money payments, which most people won't care very much about.

We'll hear much more about Russia/collusion in due course.....and maybe nobody will give a fuck then either, because who really cared about that disaster known as the Helsinki Summit?

If he can get away with Helsinki, he can get away with anything.

yes he can get away with anything and he knows it

he’s known it since before—since he said he could shoot someone in the middle of fifth avenue and not lose voters

just the other day tillerson was saying how trumpet ignora the law is impulsive and doesnt like to read. he turns the news into “tillerson lazy and dumb as a rock”. the media plays along, and as far as his base goes, he’s made of teflon.

sure, reducing his supporters to just the base is part of the whole of defeating him. but it’s not enough.

energizing the democratic base is okay, but as the latest election showed, it’s not enough because the opposition also gets energized (thanks, hilary... jeez... guess she learned from comey)

you have to peel away his base and offer a compelling proposition without the hatemongering and division—democrats have to be FOR something, not just against trump.

this has been the case on & on & on & on. today is no different. if pictures of trump sucking putin’s engorged cock were to surface, it would still be no different—the media enemy of the people etc etc. bytor would say they are clearly photoshopped.

people at this point will believe whatever they want to believe.

and yes many still believe the carnival barker

democrats need to make a better more compelling offer with a better more compelling person

it boils down to that

going on and on about russia... is ultimately a waste of time

[Skuj]

Except that Putin is having a field day while Trump does nothing about it. There's a real danger in that. I bet most Trumpists think that Putin is a great guy who means no harm to USA. "What's wrong with collusion anyway?"

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Skuj

Except that Putin is having a field day while Trump does nothing about it. There's a real danger in that. I bet most Trumpists think that Putin is a great guy who means no harm to USA. "What's wrong with collusion anyway?"

i agree that putin is a shit, but if you read the link i posted you above (worth a read i swear) you'll see that clinton had similar appearance of improprieties with china, and now we don't even talk about it, but we talk about monica's cumstained dress instead as the real historic derailer. which it was.

please understand that we're on the same side of the issue, so i don't need to be told that putin manipulating our elections is a disgrace (it is), but please also understand that i'm trying to advance the notion that focusing on this is as a way to salvation is just gonna give us 4 more years of trumpism

show me that im wrong and i'll join the chorus, but right now it seems to me a waste of time and energy and a dead end doomed to die in the senate. but yeah, the investigation needs to continue, sure.

eta: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_U...ce_controversy

[ilduclo]

 

[!@#$%!]

and skuj, here's the link i meant. take a look it's a smart guy with good analysis

https://musaalgharbi.com/2018/03/01/...-lessons-2020/

post-election his points are still valid

[Skuj]

I trust you, and I generally respect your opinion here.....but.....

The very first line of that linked piece starts with the Bytor/tesla tag-line "There is no proof of collusion" or words to that effect, to which you and I and others often counter with "but he hasn't released his report yet, so how do we know?"

Please convince me to read past the first line.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Skuj

I trust you, and I generally respect your opinion here.....but.....

The very first line of that linked piece starts with the Bytor/tesla tag-line "There is no proof of collusion" or words to that effect, to which you and I and others often counter with "but he hasn't released his report yet, so how do we know?"

Please convince me to read past the first line.

come on. this is not the kindergarten. not gonna bribe you with cookies.

well, it is the kindergarten in a way, full of screaming children, but i am trying to move on from that nonsense into more interesting conversations that might have actual value.

here's something to consider: it's not just bytor

https://www.newscientist.com/article...ias-after-all/

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...tism-listening

alright! i have hope for you man.

also, the first line is a quote from hegel. eta i mean from marx lol. ok

[Skuj]

I get it: The Dem mission cannot simply be "impeach Trump", and hanging everything on Mueller. They have to have a vision for the country post-Trump (and the only thing that keeps me sane these days is that there will actually be a post-Trump era, one day), and I don't know wtf that is yet.

(I hope O'Rourke runs.)

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by Skuj

I get it: The Dem mission cannot simply be "impeach Trump", and hanging everything on Mueller. They have to have a vision for the country post-Trump (and the only thing that keeps me sane these days is that there will actually be a post-Trump era, one day), and I don't know wtf that is yet.

yessir! that is the thing that can win 2020

Originally Posted by Skuj

(I hope O'Rourke runs.)

tbh i don't know much about him but i hope he's not some feckless snowflake. we need a brawler, but not an angry one. a happy warrior. someone who will run circles around trompetta.

i had my hopes pinned on lizzie warren but with those new parameters in mind i realize she lacks the charisma to take it all. it's okay, she's a professor. as long as she's busily setting policy in the background i hope the dems can present a compelling package of exciting ideas that will mobilize the workers without alienating business. tall order lololol. but yeah. it's gotta be that. i do not want socialismo... prefiero muerte XD

(but seriously, social democracy is great, government ownership of the means of production is not. i like a public option for health care, medicare for all might be too much and we're not there yet)

okay. thanks for listening man. not asking that we agree on all points, but it's good to have lucid allies in this mess.

[Skuj]

A slight aside: Is Melania still doing that internet bullying thing?

Because....

"Mike Pompeo is doing a great job, I am very proud of him," Trump wrote on Twitter. "His predecessor, Rex Tillerson, didn't have the mental capacity needed. He was dumb as a rock and I couldn't get rid of him fast enough. He was lazy as hell. Now it is a whole new ballgame, great spirit at State!"

[!@#$%!]

lol, those schoolyard insults, yeah

for me, tillerson landed the real punches

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rex-til...lt-2018-12-07/

[!@#$%!]

“impulsive”

“indisciplined”

“does not read”

lmao

[ilduclo]

I'm at the grocery store (with my ID in hand), looking for the smocked gouda. I can't find it. WTF? HOW am I supposed to prepare for a full day of forest raking if I can't have a proper meal to get me started?

[evollove]

I'm generous enough to allow for a typo. But he fucks it up twice in the same tweet.

[!@#$%!]

machiavellian spin: he did it on purpose to rally his illiterate base against the smug college-educated liberal elites

(kellyann’s work)

[h8kurdt]

Originally Posted by !@#$%!

machiavellian spin: he did it on purpose to rally his illiterate base against the smug college-educated liberal elites

(kellyann’s work)

You know what? I can actually believe that.

[!@#$%!]

Originally Posted by h8kurdt

You know what? I can actually believe that.

yes

hillaria won in the most educated districts, trumpet in the most uneducated

this is how democrats snatch defeat from the jaws of victory: they focus on irrelevant bullshit and alienate supporters

see for example: https://www.businessinsider.com/libe...nnoying-2017-7