[Severian]

One thing I really love about this is that it frames ATCQ as the true heroes of conscious (and street) hip-hop, leaving little room for argument about who hip-hop's historical standard bearers truly are.

Think about it:
• NWA has kind of tarnished their own rep with the ludicrous behavior of their individual members, and a film-album marketing campaign that, despite being pretty high-quality, still screamed "marketing campaign!"

• Public Enemy has crapped all over their own legacy, first with Flav's fucking despicable VH1 career (something Tip nods to on the new album, I believe), and then with this nonsense Prophets of Rage bullshit.

• Wu-Tang never occupied an overtly political space, but they did rule the roost for some time, and we all know what happened there (even if we can't identify why these exceedingly stupid and humiliating decisions were actuallly made)

• the Roots, for all their remaining strengths (I still think ...And Then Yoi Shoot Your Cousin was pretty fucking brilliant), have made some very real compromises. I understand why they made them, I guess... being the Fallon band has freed them up to do what they want in the studio, without concern for sales or charts... but I don't understand why Questlove has decided to be the rich white guy's Jiminy Cricket, or why he has associated himself with absurd marketing campaigns and talent contest tv shows. Yuck.

A Tribe Called Quest has made all of these groups seem even more distasteful and ridiculous than they already were — vying for continued relevance with stunts and promotions that are nauseating to varying degrees.

Almost as if in direct response to all this shit, Tribe has (rather quietly) stomped all over the lot of them, not with stunts but with *actual music* that comes off as classy and effortless, asserting themselves as the closest thing hip-hop cultures has to a defining act.

Kanye might be "the Black Beatle" in the sense that he's reinvented the wheel countless times and seen unprecedented critical and commercial success with album after album of epoch making, hiccup-free excellence. But ATCQ are the the real BeatleS (plural.. multiple minds, one elemental force) of hip-hop. And this makes the rest of those groups look rather sad and desperate by comparison.

We Got it From Here... shows that all you need is love and great music... not sparkles or fanfare... to be relevant and definitive.

[noisereductions]

The Roots... I don't know, I worship those guys. Quest is on my short list of dudes I'd kill to have a beer with. And when I read his book he talks about what you already mentioned - that basically Fallon has allowed The Roots to do the SY thing, which is have the freedom to do whatever the F they want. And let's be straight: they've done some very interesting things since (like an album w/ John Legend... or Elvis Costello... or Then You Shoot, etc).

Also something to think about: Fallon convinced ATCQ to come on his show for the first time in over 15 years. This immediately led to the new album. I'd be willing to bet that The Roots (or at least Questlove) had a hand in that.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by noisereductions

eh. I like political music as much as I like discussing politics on the internet. Which is not at all. I'd rather SY reunite to make dreamy violent swirls of sonic love (again).

I do think Spinhead is fantastic tho. Archival releases still make me very happy.

Yeah, but much like Tribe actually, politics has always been part of the bedrock of SY's music. Both bands exist alongside and write about social and political issues, even if it's from a more abstract perspective (Daydream Nation and Reagan, Sonic Nurse and Bush). I agree about overtly political music, for the most part. It's limiting, and it detracts from the universality and artistry of the music for many artists (especially when it's just used as a ham-fisted promo tool a la RATM).

All I meant was, maybe they'll be inspired to create some violent swirls of sonic love again. Probably not, but maybe.

Also, sometimes overt politics in music is necessary and extremely powerful (see: "Revolution #1," To Pimp a Butterfly and about half of Late Reg and MBDTF, Bob Dylan, Common's new album, Fugazi's deft balance of politics and musical ingenuity, etc., etc.) It gets stale and tepid when it detracts from the artistry of the music, because, you know, art is supposed to be interesting and enjoyable and universal as well as "important." But many of the greatest artists of all time have made some of their most significant work by fuzing politics and emotional resonance and musicianship.

"Imagine." There. That's what I'm getting at. Could have just said "Imagine" and not wasted everyone's times. Lolz

[Severian]

Originally Posted by noisereductions

The Roots... I don't know, I worship those guys. Quest is on my short list of dudes I'd kill to have a beer with. And when I read his book he talks about what you already mentioned - that basically Fallon has allowed The Roots to do the SY thing, which is have the freedom to do whatever the F they want. And let's be straight: they've done some very interesting things since (like an album w/ John Legend... or Elvis Costello... or Then You Shoot, etc).

Also something to think about: Fallon convinced ATCQ to come on his show for the first time in over 15 years. This immediately led to the new album. I'd be willing to bet that The Roots (or at least Questlove) had a hand in that.

Right. The Roots are not offenders of the Flava Flav/Rza/Dre variety. Not at all. They serve a purpose, and it may be that without the friendly household-name status the Fallon gig has given them, they wouldn't be able to make albums like Undun or ...And Then...

I still might argue that Sonic Youth did the "Sonic Youth" thing without ever being anyone's sidekick/lap dog/house band, and they sold WAY fewer records than the Roots, and never even approached the level of "household namedom" that the Roots had a decade before they joined Fallon. So... to me, it kinda seems like the Roots could do this too. BUT... truth remains that they have continued to experiment and broaden their sound, living kind of a double life and still doing plenty of awesome things on record.

So, no, they're not Prophets of Rage/Once Upon a Time in Shaolin level offenders, and I really don't think any less of them all things considered.

But Tribe still dumped all over every legacy hip-hop group's heads with thier Fallon spot, the album and the upcoming tour.

Did I mention Tribe's planning to tour? Not that it's really "Tribe" anymore.. not fully. But still... that would be pretty sweet, and if it's happening I'm there.

[louder]

Originally Posted by Severian

Calm down boyo. Maybe we're missing something absurdly awesome about the dude. I'll look into the new material if it'll make you feel better (no need with Bruno Mars, as I can count on that shit playing in Target every time I shop).

Don't get offended... like I got offended when you see inexplicably disappointed by TLOP and remained inexplicably disappointed for ¾ of a year (by the way, I'm almost afraid to ask, but do you still like it?)

I didn't mean to sound angry.. I just want y'all to give Gambino a chance when the new album drops. Like I said I used to HATE the dude. But his new singles are amazing forreal. It's possible for an artist to evolve inbetween albums.

Yes, I still like TLOP. Haha.

[louder]

Originally Posted by noisereductions

eh. I like political music as much as I like discussing politics on the internet. Which is not at all.

Explains why TPAB was a little too much for your liking.

[noisereductions]

Originally Posted by louder

Explains why TPAB was a little too much for your liking.

that may be part of it too yeah.

You hit the nail on the head about "overt" though. Of course Tribe and SY always had politics, it's just... a piece, not the whole.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by noisereductions

that may be part of it too yeah.

You hit the nail on the head about "overt" though. Of course Tribe and SY always had politics, it's just... a piece, not the whole.

Yup. Art needs to be personal and inspired before it can successfully attempt to be global. When artists use politics (or "revolution" or "protest") as their only move, it feels like a gimmick or a branding tool. It's hideous and embarrassing.

Art is best when it reflects (be it through accuracy or abstraction) life and the human experience. Politics is a huge part of that experience, so music with no political element often falls short. But politics is not all of life. In fact, it's a very small piece of the actual sensory experience of living. For an artist to really appeal to me, they have to do something that somehow speaks to me, that I recognize. There's something in Kanye's voice and delivery that I very strongly recognize and identify with, and if that wasn't present in his music, his political songs wouldn't have as strong an impact on me.

When music is just "politics" with a beat, it's like... why bother? Just go be an organizer or a politician.

Very few people seem to get why music is important to the people that really love it. So, as is the case with film and literature and poetry, a vast majority of it totally sucks ass and is awful.

[Severian]

UGH. Everyone (clickbait sites, the freaking AP) is totally misinterpreting a Kanye comment about Donald Trump.

So, yeah, he technically did say "I would have voted for Trump," and called Trump's methods effective "because he won!" But what he means, very obviously, at least to me, is that he gets why people voted for Trump. He's saying the methods Trumo used "non-political" and more like simple branding and advertising, are powerful and effective.

He then went on to say of course Trump's racist, we live in a racist country, this isn't news, let's talk about what's next. He also said he'd move his family to Canada if Trump won. So... yeah.

But still, every headline is "Kanye West supports Trump," or "Kanye: 'I would vote for Trump." Uggggghhhh.

Now what I DON'T understand is why the FUCK he apparently didn't vote. Like... what. If I knew him, I'd be considering unfriending his ass, and I'd be having very pointed, unpleasant conversations with him as I am currently having with every one of my non-voting "friends." *facepalm*

Why does he get himself into this shit?

[pepper_green]

you're funny guy.

[Severian]

Originally Posted by pepper_green

you're funny guy.

I fucking know that, greezy.

[pepper_green]

lol.

[Severian]

Oh hey Louder, because I'm such a down motherfucking guy, and I care about your ass and making you feel heard, I listened to the first single from the new Childish Gambino album.

Aaaaand... I'm sorry dude. Not for me.

I went into it expecting to like it based on your recommendation, so can't say I didn't give it a fair shot. I admire the intention. Production's cool. Scope is admirable. But he sounds like a comedian doing an imitation of James Brown doing an imitation of Steven Tyler. Which is essentially exactly what's happening here as far as I can tell.

I'll listen to the rest of the album before I make my final verdict, but I don't want to offend you, so maybe Gambino should go in the Bruno Mars pile for the time being.

[pepper_green]

Originally Posted by pepper_green

there's this dude I work with. he's mostly nice and all but he loves that song "Trappin out A Mansion". he's cool and rock and roll when drinking and smoking but, when he hits that crack rock it's "Trappin out a Mansion" and nothing else matters and he continues to play every stupid fucking song from this Young Dolph ass hole. he ungodly turns into a dumbass asshole bi polar jack off. and I hate him and his favorite shitty song. I tried to talk him out of smoking rock. but..... the crack is too good. I can even smell the cocaine when it burns. he tells me he like's hip hop, I tell him he's a shit head crackhead.

....methhead music for crackheads. you crackhead. this is what I have to put up with. and you support it and you should die!

see, this crack/meth head got locked up this week just like I knew he be. he was a fucking bi-polar asshole jack off prick!!!

see kids, this is what happens when you listen to shitty trap hip hop....you smoke meth and crack and pop too many X pills.

I can handle my shit. he couldn't. because he takes the game too seriously and is a redneck stupid fat fuck crack head white boy. and I dont' feel sorry for him one bit.

[louder]

Originally Posted by Severian

Oh hey Louder, because I'm such a down motherfucking guy, and I care about your ass and making you feel heard, I listened to the first single from the new Childish Gambino album.

Aaaaand... I'm sorry dude. Not for me.

I went into it expecting to like it based on your recommendation, so can't say I didn't give it a fair shot. I admire the intention. Production's cool. Scope is admirable. But he sounds like a comedian doing an imitation of James Brown doing an imitation of Steven Tyler. Which is essentially exactly what's happening here as far as I can tell.

I'll listen to the rest of the album before I make my final verdict, but I don't want to offend you, so maybe Gambino should go in the Bruno Mars pile for the time being.

Haha. No offense taken. We're all here to share opinions. I appreciate that you gave him a chance. That's the only thing I wanted.

[louder]

So excited about STARBOY.

[pepper_green]

dis nigga be talkin about some starboy and sheeit. ain't nobody give a damn bout some starboy. sheeeeeeeeit nigga! damn!

[pepper_green]

anyone remember Starcat? what happen to that dude?

[Severian]

Originally Posted by louder

So excited about STARBOY.

Hmm. When's that coming out again?

I hope it's more like "FML" and less "Beat it"-lite

[pepper_green]

fuck some pussy ass niggas like the weekend. niggas ain't shit. white boy be talkin bout some weekend. white boy. you is a crazy white boy ,white boy.

talking bout some mu fuckin starboy and sheeit.

deeez cuck wanna be white boys are crazy.