[Tokolosh]

I'm sick of it. Dumb ass gits!

 

STUTTGART, Germany — Police broke up two brief but violent disturbances involving English soccer fans Saturday, arresting more than 300 people the day before England plays Ecuador in a World Cup second-round match.
Following Germany's 2-0 afternoon win over Sweden, English and German fans clashed in a plaza near outdoor viewing screens in this southern German city. German fans were singing in celebration when England fans began throwing plastic chairs and bottles at them, police said.

Five Germans were injured before officers in riot gear separated the two sides. Police two or three deep corralled the English fans and waded into the crowd, arresting them one by one. In all, 200 people were arrested, most of them English.

About 50,000 England fans were expected in Stuttgart for Sunday's England-Ecuador match. They were greeted with a heavy security presence — about 1,800 officers on patrol along with British police.

Early Saturday in the same downtown area, police arrested 122 English fans who had been throwing bottles and glasses at passersby from a pub terrace. No one was reported injured. Those fans will be held until Monday, police said.

In Munich, where Germany beat Sweden, the partying was mostly peaceful, though riot police did move in on at least one group of fans in the main fan area, where officials estimated at least 65,000 revelers were in the streets.

Bottles flew as police pulled several men from one group. At least two people were taken away in ambulances. Police on the scene would not explain what precipitated the action nor say how many arrests were made.

Elsewhere, at least 56 people were arrested in various incidents, police spokeswoman Veronika Flemisch said. Aside from several arrested for trying to hop the fence into a separate stadium where the game was being broadcast, others were arrested for offenses such as drug possession and public drunkenness.

The Associated Press.

[porkmarras]

They are a shame.Bang them up,all of them.

[Trasher02]

Oh boy i wouldn't want to have a fight with this bad-ass hooligan!

 

But yes, Hooligans suck. I hate football too you know.

[sonicl]

I don't see how FIFA can prevent football hooliganism. The majority of people in Germany for the World Cup, or certainly the majority of English people, are people who have just travelled there to experience the atmosphere and be a part of what is going on. They don't have match tickets, so they have no links with FIFA. There are a number of idiots who can't control themselves after a few drinks andf think that they are doing some sort of patriotic duty by baiting "Johnny Foreigner", but, hell, they don't need a World Cup to do that. If these people weren't in Germany right now, they'd be somewhere in Greece or Spain instead, doing exactly the same kind of thing.

I'm afraid that there is some sick part of English culture that sees other European nations as being some kind of enemy, and victories over these "enemies" being something to gloat over. Our tabloid press cannot help itself from being anti-European when given the smallest opportunity, be it sport, politics (our media loves nothing more than to paint the EU as being anti-English, to slag off the European Parliament and to demand that Britain withdraws from the EU) or culture (all European films are regarded as being porn and all European music is regarded as never having progressed since the 1950s). This mentality gets ingrained among the more impressionable of our people and they start to beleive that by going abroad and fighting they are somehow striking a blow for Englishness in the face of the invading foreigner. Believe it or not, outside England's pre-World Cup friendlies there were stalls selling "joke" plastic World War 2 style army helmets and t-shirts with "slogans" like "two world wars and one world cup" and "who do you think you are kidding Mr Hitler" on them. And people were buying this crap, because they thought it was funny.

The problem is one of culture, and as long as the media, and often politicians too, continue to propogate xenophobic attitudes, that problem is always going to exist.

It's the illness that needs to be treated, not the symptoms.

[_slavo_]

FIFA should ban football

[Hip Priest]

The problem is Europe-wide: Radio Five were talking to German residents who all said that hooliganism is a lot worse on the average weekend, during normal league games, than anything during the World Cup; travelling fans from African countries are being given leaflets by the German authoriies advising them to stay away from certain areas; the regular levels of violence amongst Turkish and Italians fans are a very serious concern; racism and it's associated violence are regular occurences in most countries.

And of course there are the English hooligans - no attempt at denial here. We have a lot less of a problem here now than we did 15 years ago, although of course one hopes that any present offenders are suitably dealt with. Much progress has been made at barring people, but there still exists a determined, organised section who always manage to get through the controls.

The German Police issud a statement that it was some German 'fans' who initiated the chair-throwing, and a section of the thousands of English 'fans' retaiated. Understandably, the possibility of a thousand-strong crowd worried the German police, and they have taken action.

[Tokolosh]

Originally Posted by Hip Priest

The problem is Europe-wide: Radio Five were talking to German residents who all said that hooliganism is a lot worse during normal league games than anything during the World Cup; travelling fans from African countries are being given leaflets by the German authoriies advising them to stay away from certain areas; the regular levels of violence amongst Turkish and Italians fans are a very serious concern; racism and it's associated violence are regular occurences in most countries now.

And of course there are the English hooligans - no attempt at denial here. We have a lot less of a problem here now than we did 15 years ago, although of course one hopes that any present offenders are suitably dealt with. Much progress has been made at barring people, but there still exists a determined, organised section who always manage to get through the controls.

The German Police issud a statement that it was some German 'fans' who initiated the chair-throwing, and a section of the thousands of English 'fans' retaiated. Understandably, the possibility of a thousand-strong crowd worried the German police, and they have taken action.

Don't get me wrong guys. I'm not specifically picking on the english hoolies. I just used the Stuttgart inccident as an example. There are many other instances where it was much worse.

[Hip Priest]

Of course, Tokolosh. Nor was I attempting in any way to defend, or deny the severity of, incidents involving the foul monsters whom we produce; and it does indeed seem that the larger incidents at this World Cup involve English fans. I'll never understand how our culture - sometimes so tolerant and lovely - manages time and time again to produce this problem.

In the current isuue of Private Eye, a German corrspondent writes: Travelling non-white football fans who are the target of an official leaflet campaign to warn them of the dangers of straying off the beaten track - into areas where they might recieve a less than cordial welcome - might wrongly conclude that they are the potential victims of a hate campaign specific to the World Cup. This is, of course, the government line. It is equally nonsense.

I think the point is that the racists and thugs do not exist because of football - football is merely a convenient focal point for them to create a throwback 'community' around their beliefs, with regular opportunities to meet up. They are not just violent around football events - they are in town and city centres most nights, and somehow dealing with football will not deal with the problem, because in the final analysis football is by no means the problem. The governments, of course, are happy to have the problem seen as a football one, when in reality it is anything but. If the attitude and behaviour of the yobs were truly football-related then football indeed would have been banned, and organisations like the British BNP or the German NPD would not exist. Nor would countries like Austria and Italy give a parliamentary mandate to those with suspect views.

The hateful undercurrents run very deep.

It's also worth noting that in most cases the number of incidents is proportional to the number of fans from the respective country - more English fans = more English incidents. The media, of course, highlight incidents of English hooliganism with salivating, morbid joy; the reputation that English yobs created 20 yeras ago has not died, or even improved as our behaviour has improved (and for all our remaining faults, it has improved enormously).

THe English fans have been praised by the GErman police at this World Cup on a variety of occaisions; the general feeling amongst the German authorities is that the English fans have been amongst the best-behaved. It says a lot about the progress that has been made that a World Cup in Germany can witness that kind of respect for English fans. However, if Portugal knock us out on Saturday (as they should, all things being considered), then we shall see how our reputation stands on Sunday morning...

Originally Posted by Tokolosh

Should FIFA ban football hooligans altogether?

These people should have no access to the World Cup, at all, ever. Or to any event whatsoever where other people might reasonably expect to have a good time. Or indeed to any right-thinking community. It's sad that they exist at all; even sadder that normal people have to share the same planet with them.

[Tokolosh]

Well put Hip Priest.

[jon boy]

they should be put into roman style gladitorial competitions with table legs and baseball bats.

with these guys its always the same, when they are in a group they all think that they are tough, cool and some kind of gangsta but get them on their own and they cry for their mum.

well done hip priest. its true that a lot of them are really not interested in football at all and just want to fight and vent frustration. a friend who went to the first match in frankfurt said that all it was gonna take for trouble to start is for england to lose or someone to spill someones drink/insult someones home town. i dont think that they are fans just sheep who go along with whatever stereotype they follow.

[kingcoffee]

First of all, soccer (football, futbol, etc.) is lame. It's a great game if you want to stay in shape, but it's just so fricking boring to watch. And yes they should ban all soccer hooligans becausethese people are fucking insane!! Theyn riot becuase their team loses a game! It's just a fucking game! They set fires and beat people to death over a goddamn soccer match! These people should be thrown in prison and given harsh sentences.

[Пятхъдесят Шест]

Originally Posted by kingcoffee

First of all, soccer (football, futbol, etc.) is lame.

Oh? Really? Shit, you must be right. I'll never watch again. Thank you, oh wise King Coffee. I've been living a lie!!! For SHAME!!!

Topic at hand: I can't think of a reason to keep them around. Lets be honest, binge drinking before games is never a good idea.

[atari 2600]

 

 

it's the same with a lot of sports...at a certain level of competition, fans either riot regardless of whether their team wins or loses...now that's lame. as for the sport of soccer, there's a lot to appreciate that you probably simply don't have the attention span or patience for, kingcoffee. Try decaf hehe.

[Toilet & Bowels]

the english fans are the best at being well behaved, and the best at being badly behaved.

on a more serious note though, i think the majority of known british football hooligans are denied passports, and the police are supposedly particularly vigilant of these people's movements circa international footballing tournaments. so it's not like the authorities just allow hooliganism free reign.


still, showing johnny foreigner what for is an english tradition that stretches back centuries.

[Пятхъдесят Шест]

Also, racism doesn't seem rampant in England. The EPL games I watch (thank you Fox Soccer Channel) never have occurances where fans are taunting players for their race. Which is a beautiful thing!

Italy and Spain are notorious for it.

[khchris(original)]

Football Hooliganism is really more about social identity and rites of license. The game itself is just a reason or base for it to happen. If chess was just as popular and had just as many supporters, it would happen just the same. I almost get the feeling it could be partially because European societies may feel a little oppressed and not so free, so when there is a sporting event(like football), these people feel better in "numbers" and usually will follow the core group leaders and end up causing trouble because they feel it's the one time they can do it and get away with it, possibly because of weak security standards.

Just like protests & rallies, there's a good number of participants who are just "following" the rest of the people to feel apart of an identity.

You want to get rid of it? Maybe not having such a whimpy police and security and actually firing off some rounds in the air to scare some people may do the trick. Extreme, but only way to tame a wild beast is sometimes with force.

[Пятхъдесят Шест]

You're totally making more out of drunk morons than you need to.

[acousticrock87]

Soccer...hooligans. But how do they ban something uncontrolled by them?

[DemonBox]

Originally Posted by Пятхъдесят Шест

Also, racism doesn't seem rampant in England. The EPL games I watch (thank you Fox Soccer Channel) never have occurances where fans are taunting players for their race. Which is a beautiful thing!

Italy and Spain are notorious for it.

Yeah that sucks, it tends to be a problem here in Norway. Namecalling and spitting, shit like that. I love the game, but the culture around football, can be rather shitty.

[Пятхъдесят Шест]

They already are banned.