Is it fair to implement affirmative action policies to solve questions of racial.....
 

Is it fair to implement affirmative action policies to solve questions of racial inequality?

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/wideangle/shows/brazil2/

Brazil in Black and White



The Issue

As one of the most racially diverse nations in the world, Brazil has long considered itself a colorblind "racial democracy." But deep disparities in income, education and employment between lighter and darker-skinned Brazilians have prompted a civil rights movement advocating equal treatment of Afro-Brazilians. In Brazil, the last country in the Western Hemisphere to have abolished slavery, blacks today make up almost half of the total population -- but nearly two-thirds of the nation's poor. Institutions of higher education have typically been monopolized by Brazil's wealthy and light-skinned elite, and illiteracy among black Brazilians is twice as high as among whites. Now, affirmative action programs are changing the rules of the game, with many colleges and universities reserving 20% of spots for Afro-Brazilians. But with national surveys identifying over 130 different categories of skin color, including "cinnamon," "coffee with milk," and "toasted," who will be considered "black enough" to qualify for the new racial quotas?


The Film

"Am I black or am I white?" Even before they ever set foot in a college classroom, many Brazilian university applicants must now confront a question with no easy answer. BRAZIL IN BLACK AND WHITE follows the lives of five young college hopefuls from diverse backgrounds as they compete to win a coveted spot at the elite University of Brasilia, where 20 percent of the incoming freshmen must qualify as Afro-Brazilian. Outside the university, WIDE ANGLE reports on the controversial racial debate roiling Brazil through profiles of civil right activists, opponents of affirmative action, and one of the country's few black senators.

If you treat everyone equally and give everyone the same education and opportunities why is "positive discrimination" necessary?

What amazes me is "races" or "ethnic groups" always look outwards for the reason they are on skid row rather than inwards

Jobs and positions should be based on a meritocracy rather than some pc assholes pathetic attempt at justifying their own existence in a job

Lets get back to basics, treat everyone the same, and if they fuck up its regardless of race, creed or colour

"Positive discrimination", "affirmative action" or to give it its real name, "racism in favour of minorities" does nothing but breed resentment and insult those in minorities who make a success of their lives on their own merit

Yes, so I see.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Savage Clone again.

that's a big "IF". and it doesn't happen.

I am slow on the intake here. They're implementing entry rules in universities to make sure at least 20% of those accepted are afro-brazilian?

Give him some credit. Everyone knows this. This whole thread is essentially discussing ways of approaching an ideal, and we all know what the scoop is.

yeah. good call.

the funny part (as the original post points out) i that in latin-america everybody has been fucking everybody for centuries, unlike in the u.s., and therefore "cinnamon" "milk and coffee" (ha ha) don't know who is what color.

true story: i have african ancestors, both black and north-african semites. but i'm a vague hue of beige.

anyway, gotta go.

It happens in the UK

Here so called minorities have more resources thrown at them than so called majorities resulting in over achievement by minorities and under achievement by the indigenous population regardless of race creed or colour

Alright. Well I don't know.. like it was called above, it's 'positive discrimination'. I think if applicants remained faceless/raceless it would be better for everyone- it shouldn't matter what racial background you have, it should be about intelligence.

Sorry if this seems like a low-brow reply or whatever..

the "positive discrimination" in the application is meant to make up for "negative discrimination" in the rest of the world. which is not a fiction.

ps- white people are often painfully unaware of racial discrimination, as they tend to be in the giving & not the receiving end of it, in spite of all "best intentions".

Well said

Treat everyone the same and get rid of the politically correct idiots who think ethnic groups need a leg up as their religion, race or colour is some sort of handicap

Out with political correctness, in with common sense

It's still discrimination. Somebody is still getting fucked over.

you're not getting the point of it. it's ok.

Okay, well nevermind.

Exactly, discrimination is discrimination however you dress it up

Why should it be illegal to discriminate against a "minority" and legal to discriminate against a "majority"?

Um, if you make a point we might get it

You just need to see this won't end good, just look in America.

Who was that directed at?

Everybody.

The 800 pound gorilla in this room is the fact that there is no "solution" to racial (or gender, or cultural) inequality.
Unless you count figuring out a way to fundamentally change human nature, of course.

He should try and find a way to lose all those pounds instead. Savage.

Well as we take in one in five of europes migrants we dont seem to have much of a problem in the UK

i already did, just read my posts again for comprehension.

unfortunately i don't have time to stay & argue on the internet this afternoon.


ha ha ha ha

ok. i gotta go.

I have read them and short of being patronising to another poster here you fail to make any point whatsoever except to repeat the same old "downtrodden" "hard done by" minorities drivel that is insulting to both majority and minority communities globally

Treat everyone the same

It works here

Aw man. I stumbled into an argument half-assed and now I'm racist. :(

I would agree with you ThePits, but at least in America it is not possible. Look at the south a lot of people who are in charge still are looking for desegregation. They do not sya it but they wish it.

I do agree with you when minorities complain a lot, and do not do much to improve their lot in life.

there IS no solution to it to reiterate what drone said
from a technical standpoint it wouldn't be fair because then all races don't get "equal" treatment
equal treatment and equal opportunity are not synonymous.

???

You, you, you BIGOT you:rolleyes:

SynthethicalY in the UK we still have regionalised pockets of bigotry, but frankly, within deprived "majority" communities, so called positive discrimination plays straight into the hands of extremists by pandering to the argument of "foreigners who have paid sod all into the system are being put before people who have worked all their life" etc

The very simple solution is treat everyone on merit

Lets face it, there isnt a race creed or colour that doesnt have its fair share or racists, assholes or just downright lazy sods

The sooner we all accept that the better

i don't have a problem with illegal immigrants or immigrant workers or anything like that but they need to learn to speak english well enough to communicate effectively with americans if they're going to work here.

I agree with that. I am probably selling out my own kind. However, my view is if my parents can learn having multiple jobs then it is possible. But then again in the 70's there wasn't any Spanish media or the likes. It was Either English or English.

why?

Because if you go to a country isnt it simple courtesy to learn the local language?

Not expect everyone else to bend over backwards and change to yours?

When in Rome..........

doesn't it go the other way around? why should you expect someone who is obviously functioning fine without learning the language you happen to speak to bend over backwards and change his/her life to yours? after all, there are 235 recognized languages in the United States.....

Funny, the last time I heard the official language in the US was English

And functioning fine in ones own country doesnt give anyone the right to force their language on somebody elses

Lets respect everyones human rights, including the majority of people in their own country who have the temerity to demand the right to speak their own language:rolleyes:

US has no official language, am I right?

My apologies you are right, the USA has no official language

I think the official language of England is still English though..........

yet another advantage to being a bloodthirsty robot....

when will you meatsacks ever learn?

you ALL taste like chicken.

I don't care if it's leg or a breast when I reach in the bucket; it just needs to be cooked right.

the sad thing is, 95% of most meat isn't properly done (and you can get really sick from it). :(

All I meant by that was that we get it: you don't despise people of African origin or whose ancestors were of African origin. It's also just as easy to get across the point that one is OK with people of other ethnicities without adopting a religion with a fairly hefty Black Pride emphasis and a militant wing, going to an Ethiopian church (more power to you on all this if it works for you, by the way; I'm making no value judgment on your lifestyle choices here), posting numerous run-on sentences peppered with phrases like "The Lion Of Judah" and the like, and claiming there is no "true American folk music because it was all stolen or approriated from the African slaves and their traditions," which is of course a false statement that completely ignores the huge influence of British Isles and other European folksong tradition that travelled over to this country and survived and mutated, even working its way into the black tradition via drum and fife music. We get it. You would like to see the Black Man succeed. This is a noble aspiration; you just don't need to demonize your own kind to get across the point that you don't approve of everything your own race has done throughout its history. All races and cultures have events in their histories that they shoudn't be proud of.